Addressing A Question About Ohio Issue 3 [UPDATED]
Yesterday I received an email which contained many questions about Issue 3. In my reply, I (and I know this is difficult to believe) confused a few things and may have led the recipient astray. So I’ve decided to print the email here and attempt a second, and more accurate, reply.
Via email -
I cannot find a breakdown of the 34,000 jobs. There should be about 8,000 per casino. Estimates seem to be: 1000 house maintenance (jobs for Ohioans); 2000 jobs for Ohioans for casino construction (2year positions); 500 professional (dealers, machine operators, slot technicians, odds calculators, executive staff, lawyers, odds calculators, etc. (non-Ohio jobs hired by Casino operators who can be trusted and relied on; 1000 jobs in the communities (supplies, food cleaning, repair, etc.) jobs for Ohioans. This adds up to 4,000 jobs for Ohioans and 4500 total jobs What are the other 3500 jobs per casino? Another thing that bothers me is that Ohio only gets 33 1/3 per cent of the winnings. If the winnings are $1.0 billion, this would not cover the needs of the Ohio deficit. How can we guarantee Ohio will meet its budget needs? Any increase in direct taxes would guarantee that the deficit would be covered. I do NOT like tax increases, but a tax increase would guarantee that Ohio needs were met. Indeed, non-gamblers could probably procure more for the Ohio economy by spending their money on tv’s play stations. movies ball games and other pleasures than Ohio will get from the 33 13% of the casino’s declared earnings. We cannot guarantee casino winnings. Also, many patrons of nearby, out of state gamblers would remain loyal to their old casinos; they were like homes to them, that is where their friends gamble. Until I get answers to this breakdown, I must vote NO. If you can give me this breakdown, my friends and I could possibly vote YES, but not without the breakdown.
What are your thoughts on casinos? I feel that overall, Ohio gains nothing and loses much
Thomas [last name redacted]
In my initial reply, I confused thousands with hundreds and may have misled “Thomas”. So here it is…
The breakdown that I’ve been able to get is limited. Thomas’ outline of actual casino workers seems to be probable. But without actual numbers of job assignments, I cannot say for sure. However, his central question seems to me (if I’m looking at it correctly) is the difference between the numbers of casino workers and the touted 34,000 jobs as stated in the University of Cincinnati study.
It is simple. At no time has anyone promised that 34,000 workers would be employed at the same time. The numbers not accounted for by Thomas in his speculative analysis are construction jobs. Somebody has to build the danged things.
The next item that seemed to concern Thomas was the 33 1/3% tax on winnings. As Thomas says, “… Ohio only gets 33 1/3 per cent of the winnings.” ONLY?!? If you had a dollar and had to give another person 1/3 of that dollar you’d be kind of pissed wouldn’t you? How much does Thomas want the state to get? The whole dollar?!? I think 33 1/3% of winnings is MORE than fair.
The next item up for bids, Thomas seemed further concerned on the tax issue. He said, “If the winnings are $1.0 billion, this would not cover the needs of the Ohio deficit.” This is a two part item even though it reads as if it were one.
First, the $1 billion number that has been thrown around is the estimated drain on the Ohio economy that is entering neighboring states as gamblers from Ohio leave the Buckeye State to engage in legal gambling. That is a total amount of money leaving, not an estimate of winnings. By building 4 casinos here in Ohio it is expected that Ohio would retain an estimated $1 billion that is currently flowing into Indiana, West Virginia, the DPRM*, and Pennsylvania NOT as Thomas assumes add up to the amount of winnings that Ohio can tax.
Ohio participates in a multi-state lottery known as Mega Millions. The state of Ohio receives from a winner of a Mega Millions jackpot – who resides in the state of Ohio – 6% of that jackpot in taxes. I’m sure that we can all agree that 33 1/3% in tax revenue to the various authorities within the state of Ohio is far greater that the 6% that is currently collected by the state in other games.
Secondly, his question about offsetting the budget deficit. To this I believe I was clear to Thomas in my reply via email. However, I will attempt to illustrate it again here for everyone to see.
Nobody has EVER made a claim that the tax revenue generated after these casinos are built will offset the out of control spending in Columbus. Democrats are Democrats and they have never met a tax or spending program that they don’t like (with the exception of defense spending that is). Doubt this fact? Just take some time to study Detroit – and the entire DPRM* for that matter – and you will see what I’m mean.
Ted Strickland is going to continue to spend more than is coming in because that is what Democrats do. They are overly concerned about fighting a futile war on poverty instead of addressing issues which can actually improve the lives of many who are impoverished. Democrats have a habit of believing that their “Robin Hood” mentality of taking from those who have in order to give it to those who have-not (after a reduction for government handling that is) in the form of programs that are inefficient and wasteful. Rather than improving business conditions in the state of Ohio which would lead to more jobs in the state of Ohio, Ted Strickland would rather increase hand-out programs and make asinine arbitrary mandates on class room sizes in education. Whether Issue 3 is approved or not, Ohio is still going to have a budget shortfall. The question I pose to Thomas is, how bad do you want that shortfall to be? If people are working in Ohio on building these 4 facilities, they will be paying taxes they are not currently paying. Isn’t that the goal? I thought was.
Thomas next asks, “How can we guarantee Ohio will meet its budget needs? Any increase in direct taxes would guarantee that the deficit would be covered.”
I’m sorry Thomas, but if you think that increases in direct taxes are a way of guaranteeing Ohio will make its budgetary needs you are living in the same fantasy world Barack Obama and Congressional Democrats live in when they suggest that increased taxes in a recession is the way to end a recession. It has been proven time and again that when you increase tax rates on anything, government revenue declines. Taxes are a tool to dissuade behavior. So, if you tax more income, those who can control the amount they earn will earn less. Those who create jobs, will not create jobs. It is a simple matter of economics and a fact of life. His suggestion (as an example) of how this can be done illustrates this idea.
Thomas says, “Indeed, non-gamblers could probably procure more for the Ohio economy by spending their money on tv’s play stations. movies ball games and other pleasures than Ohio will get from the 33 13% of the casino’s declared earnings.”
This is an asinine idea. Currently Ohio levies a 5.5% sales tax on the items that Thomas has listed. The various 88 counties also have an “option” of adding an addition percentage as a “rider” on the sales tax. If this rate were to increase, the final costs of those items would naturally increase and fewer (not more) people would purchase them. I ask then, if fewer people buy these items, how then can you say that a budget deficit that is currently not being offset by the taxes already collected on them would suddenly offset it? That is backwards thinking if I ever heard of it.
Thomas points out a very real truth, “We cannot guarantee casino winnings.” We also cannot guarantee how many people would be willing to buy a Playstation if the state increased the sales tax on them now can we?
Thomas then brings up, “… many patrons of nearby, out of state gamblers would remain loyal to their old casinos; they were like homes to them, that is where their friends gamble.”
First off, the chances that these “patrons” having friends that they like to gamble with who are not already their neighbors here in Ohio is remote. It’s not like out of state gambling is creating friendships across state lines. So that argument is moot.
Secondly, I’m sure that Argosy Casino in Indiana will see a dramatic drop in their Ohio patronage if a casino is built in Cincinnati. Argosy[1] is only 20 minutes away from Cincinnati. I also believe that the MGM Grand Detroit would see a decline if a casino is built in Toledo. Additionally, I suspect that Northeast Ohioans would rather go to a casino in Cleveland and keep their money in our economy than drive an equal distance to Erie, PA to play at Presque Isle.
By his list of questions, I’m beginning to wonder if Thomas is genuine in his concern about the issue or is he an out of state shill looking to poke holes in the proponents’ arguments? Either way I think that that I have provided enough information but in the event that I haven’t, I have some information from the Issue 3 website.
- The Ohio Jobs and Growth Plan is the right proposal at the right time. It provides far more benefit to the state, county and local governments, schools, and the people of Ohio than any previous casino gaming ballot proposal.
- The proponents of the Ohio Jobs and Growth Plan conducted extensive research to develop a proposal we believe Ohio voters will want to support.
- The proposal authorizes four first-class casinos, located at specific sites in Ohio’s four largest cities –Cleveland, Cincinnati, Columbus and Toledo.
- The proposal requires a minimum of $250 million in private economic investment in first-class casinos in each of Ohio’s four largest cities – a total of $1 billion in required economic investment.
- The state will also receive upfront license fee payments totaling $200 million, specifically designated for job training and workforce development projects.
- Gross casino revenues will be taxed at a rate of 33 percent. Based on estimated annual gross casino revenues of $1.97 billion, approximately $651 million in casino tax revenue will be generated each year, with counties and Ohio schools receiving the bulk of those revenues. (See Distribution of Casino Tax Revenues.)
- The proposal will create an estimated 34,000 new jobs for the state.
- Ohio’s neighboring states (Michigan, Pennsylvania, West Virginia, and Indiana) as well as New York and the Canadian province of Ontario all have one or more form of legalized gaming generating hundreds of millions of dollars in tax revenues annually for each.
- A bipartisan commission – funded through casino tax revenues – will be created to develop rules for casino gaming in Ohio, license casino operators, and to oversee and ensure the integrity of casino operations.
- Portions of the casino tax revenue are also designated for the host cities; for the Ohio State Racing Commission to help revitalize the state’s horse racing industry; for law enforcement training; and for research and treatment of problem gambling and substance abuse.
- Primary backers of the proposal are Dan Gilbert (majority owner of the NBA’s Cleveland Cavaliers and Chairman and Founder of Quicken Loans) and Penn National Gaming, Inc., a prominent owner and operator of casinos and racetracks, including Raceway Park in Toledo.
Issue 3 is about the economy of Ohio. Just as the United States cannot sustain itself as long as money is being ripped from our economy and shipped via wire transfer to Mexico by illegal aliens, Ohio cannot sustain itself if an estimated $1 billion a year leaving our state. This is an opportunity to retain that $1 billion and create some jobs for some folks who need them.
You will notice that the claims of Issue 3’s proposed casinos hiring out of state workers have been dropped by the opposition in their advertisements. I wonder why? Could it be that they have been proven false?
What hasn’t been talked about much when we discuss the estimated 34,000 jobs that will be created is the collateral impact on the communities in which these 4 casinos will be located. Restaurants, hotels, and entertainment venues will all be built or boosted. These locations will need additional employees all of which will be tax paying Ohioans as well. But perhaps Thomas’ myopic view of Issue 3 can be corrected.
[UPDATE]
I have been contacted by my source in The Ohio Jobs and Growth organization which is spearheading this issue with the following email concerning Thomas.
He’s grasping for straws and doesn’t understand the proposal. We don’t claim to balance the budget, in fact, we’re pretty happy the money ISN’T going to the state, it’s going to local governments as a supplement. Also, we expect revenue to be nearly $2 billion putting estimated tax revenues at $651 million per year (the state’s own analysis came up with $643 million, a difference of about 2%). Feel free to use any of that in a response.
This response from my source along with supplemental emails from Thomas himself, is actually leading me to believe that he is a plant. Someone who is either from TRUTH PAC or an out of state interest wishing to block Issue 3. His questions seem to be distracting from the real issue – Ohio’s economy and jobs.
I remain cordial with Thomas in my responses to him because I cannot be sure that he is a shill as I suspect. That said however, I believe that addressing him any further is a waste of time because I don’t believe that a possibility exists for any additional yes votes out of Thomas and his mystery “friends”.
Campers, I’m just a blogger with an opinion. I’m not connected with The Ohio Jobs and Growth organization spearheading this Issue. I was even on the fence about Issue 3 until just a few short weeks ago. What you have to understand is the state of Ohio is bleeding jobs at a rate that is unsustainable. For our state to survive, there has to be a retention of jobs, growth of jobs, and a retention of the economy. We cannot reverse the recessive economy in Ohio if we don’t first stop the bleeding.
Ohio’s neighbors are bleeding money out of Ohio’s economy. Two of these states are better off than Ohio is economically. One is worse and the other is just as bad. As a state we cannot afford to continue to prop up the economies of our neighbors. We must retain what belongs to us. Issue 3 is not a complete solution however it is a beginning.
Vote yes on Issue 3.
[Note: Content Exclusive]
References and/or Footnotes:
- Argosy Casino is owned by Penn National which is a sponsor of Ohio Issue 3 [↩]

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